On Tue, 16 Mar 2010 21:18:11 +0000, Martin Jay
wrote:

Well, well, well. Despite all it's community based fully charm,
giffgaff is just another con.

A few days ago I noticed my giffgaff balance had unexpectedly dropped
by GBP5, so I sent an email requesting a refund.

One of con-con giff-gaff's sycophants, presumably 'andy,' has accused
me of lying. If anyone has any idea what he's talking about please
let me know.

Perhaps he's confusing my own comments with the lies I've quoted from
con-con giffgaff.
--
Martin Jay
Back the Ban: http://www.backtheban.com/
League Against Cruel Sports: http://www.league.org.uk/

"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:56:17 +0000, Steve Terry wrote:
"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 22:39:26 +0000, Steve Terry wrote:

As Christine Keeler said "they would say that wouldn't they"

Mandy Rice-Davies actually! .-)

Yes you're right
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandy_Rice-Davies

But Keeler probably would have liked to have said it ;-)

I didn't need Wikipedia! I remember her saying it at the time! .-)


I was only a boy but I remember the incident too, just got the wrong girl.
A million years ago when politicians resigned when caught out.

Steve Terry
--
Get a free Three 3pay Sim with £2 bonus after £10 top up
http://freeagent.three.co.uk/stand/view/id/5276

On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 00:07:32 +0000, Martin Jay
wrote:

One of con-con giff-gaff's sycophants, presumably 'andy,' has accused
me of lying. If anyone has any idea what he's talking about please
let me know.

Perhaps he's confusing my own comments with the lies I've quoted from
con-con giffgaff.

Got to the bottom of this. Apparently 'andy' thinks the middle
sentence in the two quotes below are the same. I'm a liar because I
think they look different and because I sought clarification over
which middle sentence he was referring to.

----- Begin Quote -----

I really think the time for making up rhetorically argument is over

The information or service provider hosted on 2ergo believes you
subscribed, rightly or wrongly

A staff member has publicly offered to help you as much as possible
with your case to the provider for a refund.

That would tend to imply that if you didn't subscribe, and that
giffgaff can help you show that you didn't subscribe, they would be
willing to do so.

So basically, you are simultaneously demanding help and rebutting it.

----- End Quote -----

And

----- Begin Quote -----

A staff member has publicly offered to help you as much as possible
with your case to the provider for a refund.

That would tend to imply that if you didn't subscribe, and that
giffgaff can help you show that you didn't subscribe, they would be
willing to do so.

So basically, you are simultaneously demanding help and rebutting it.

----- End Quote -----
--
Martin Jay
Back the Ban: http://www.backtheban.com/
League Against Cruel Sports: http://www.league.org.uk/

On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 00:13:55 +0000, Steve Terry wrote:

"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:56:17 +0000, Steve Terry wrote:
"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 22:39:26 +0000, Steve Terry wrote:

As Christine Keeler said "they would say that wouldn't they"

Mandy Rice-Davies actually! .-)

Yes you're right
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandy_Rice-Davies

But Keeler probably would have liked to have said it ;-)

I didn't need Wikipedia! I remember her saying it at the time! .-)


I was only a boy but I remember the incident too, just got the wrong
girl. A million years ago when politicians resigned when caught out.

Yes. Profumo ended up to be a nice man who did a lot of good.

--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 00:07:32 +0000, Martin Jay wrote:

On Tue, 16 Mar 2010 21:18:11 +0000, Martin Jay
wrote:

Well, well, well. Despite all it's community based fully charm,
giffgaff is just another con.

A few days ago I noticed my giffgaff balance had unexpectedly dropped by
GBP5, so I sent an email requesting a refund.

One of con-con giff-gaff's sycophants, presumably 'andy,' has accused me
of lying. If anyone has any idea what he's talking about please let me
know.

I can't see any accusation of lying. An accusation of ignorance would be
fairly accurate, though. And arrogance, too.

--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

On 18 Mar, 00:43, Martin Jay wrote:
On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 00:07:32 +0000, Martin Jay

wrote:
One of con-con giff-gaff's sycophants, presumably 'andy,' has accused
me of lying. *If anyone has any idea what he's talking about please
let me know.

Perhaps he's confusing my own comments with the lies I've quoted from
con-con giffgaff.

Got to the bottom of this. *Apparently 'andy' thinks the middle
sentence in the two quotes below are the same. *I'm a liar because I
think they look different and because I sought clarification over
which middle sentence he was referring to.

----- Begin Quote -----

I really think the time for making up rhetorically argument is over

The information or service provider hosted on 2ergo believes you
subscribed, rightly or wrongly

A staff member has publicly offered to help you as much as possible
with your case to the provider for a refund.

That would tend to imply that if you didn't subscribe, and that
giffgaff can help you show that you didn't subscribe, they would be
willing to do so.

So basically, you are simultaneously demanding help and rebutting it.

----- End Quote -----

And

----- Begin Quote -----

A staff member has publicly offered to help you as much as possible
with your case to the provider for a refund.

That would tend to imply that if you didn't subscribe, and that
giffgaff can help you show that you didn't subscribe, they would be
willing to do so.

So basically, you are simultaneously demanding help and rebutting it.

----- End Quote -----


more bull****

you shortened the quote, and my very next post asked if you'd read the
middle sentence in it

then I quoted that quote, said there were three sentences, and which
was the middle of those three

I really can't figure out why you find it such a thrill to spend hours
on this, abusing and rebutting every single offer of help, then
whining that there was nobody willing to help

it was suggested to you that contacting the number provider would help
glea info on the identity of the service subscribed to, but you
wouldn't have that either

you are still persisiting with complaining that giffgaff has done
nothing to help, whioch is untrue as they have identified the service
and offered to help you claim your money back

even then, you were still ranting on very recently about having to
wait for 3 months to hear from Phonepayplus, when you're evidently too
arrogant or too lazy to simply phone up PlanetCalling and ask them for
a refund


and through all of this, let's not forget that there is a reasonable
chance you actually received a message, and then there's just a chance
that it would have thanked you for subscribing, and named itself

if so, all your demands that giffgaff sort this out would be somewhat
perverse if you sat back and let them make the effort to discover
something you may well have known all along

On Mar 18, 1:24*am, andy wrote:
On 18 Mar, 00:43, Martin Jay wrote:





On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 00:07:32 +0000, Martin Jay

wrote:
One of con-con giff-gaff's sycophants, presumably 'andy,' has accused
me of lying. *If anyone has any idea what he's talking about please
let me know.

Perhaps he's confusing my own comments with the lies I've quoted from
con-con giffgaff.

Got to the bottom of this. *Apparently 'andy' thinks the middle
sentence in the two quotes below are the same. *I'm a liar because I
think they look different and because I sought clarification over
which middle sentence he was referring to.

----- Begin Quote -----

I really think the time for making up rhetorically argument is over

The information or service provider hosted on 2ergo believes you
subscribed, rightly or wrongly

A staff member has publicly offered to help you as much as possible
with your case to the provider for a refund.

That would tend to imply that if you didn't subscribe, and that
giffgaff can help you show that you didn't subscribe, they would be
willing to do so.

So basically, you are simultaneously demanding help and rebutting it.

----- End Quote -----

And

----- Begin Quote -----

A staff member has publicly offered to help you as much as possible
with your case to the provider for a refund.

That would tend to imply that if you didn't subscribe, and that
giffgaff can help you show that you didn't subscribe, they would be
willing to do so.

So basically, you are simultaneously demanding help and rebutting it.

----- End Quote -----

more bull****

you shortened the quote, and my very next post asked if you'd read the
middle sentence in it

then I quoted that quote, said there were three sentences, and which
was the middle of those three

I really can't figure out why you find it such a thrill to spend hours
on this, abusing and rebutting every single offer of help, then
whining that there was nobody willing to help

it was suggested to you that contacting the number provider would help
glea info on the identity of the service subscribed to, but you
wouldn't have that either

you are still persisiting with complaining that giffgaff has done
nothing to help, whioch is untrue as they have identified the service
and offered to help you claim your money back

even then, you were still ranting on very recently about having to
wait for 3 months to hear from Phonepayplus, when you're evidently too
arrogant or too lazy to simply phone up PlanetCalling and ask them for
a refund

and through all of this, let's not forget that there is a reasonable
chance you actually received a message, and then there's just a chance
that it would have thanked you for subscribing, and named itself

if so, all your demands that giffgaff sort this out would be somewhat
perverse if you sat back and let them make the effort to discover
something you may well have known all along- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Actually there is another recent thread in u.t.m. reporting a similar
incident from a crowd called bobmobile.co.uk - see "bobmobile,
scamming thieving crooks"

In their very long winded Ts&Cs they state that:

====

"Access without Registration"

Access without Registration. COMPANY may provide you with access to
some Services without you registering as a user. In that case your
identification is based on other means of identification that COMPANY
deems appropriate. Identification is typically based on data
identifying your Subscription, such as your mobile phone number. You
agree that such information may be collected and disclosed to COMPANY
and used in accordance with Section 3.

====

And that is what they did - having obtained the OP's mobile no. they
sent him 5 texts at £2.50 each - unsolicited.

So these scams do exist and you don't have to register for them, or
fill out a form on a web site. These b'stards will pick a number out
of the air and use it - or more likely generate thousands of numbers
and send them all expensive texts.

CJB.

On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 18:54:11 -0700 (PDT), CJB
wrote:

And that is what they did - having obtained the OP's mobile no. they
sent him 5 texts at £2.50 each - unsolicited.

So these scams do exist and you don't have to register for them, or
fill out a form on a web site. These b'stards will pick a number out
of the air and use it - or more likely generate thousands of numbers
and send them all expensive texts.

I think we all know it goes on.

In my case it seems to be generally accepted the charge was wrong.

I'm told the company that actually billed me isn't responsible. They
accept I shouldn't have been charged, but it's not their fault.
Apparently.

I'm expected to go elsewhere for a refund: make phone calls, write
letters and fill out web forms...

And, despite dong all this, there is no guarantee that I will receive
that refund.

Okay, so I'm only down GBP5.10. It's no the end of the world. Really.

--
Martin Jay
Back the Ban: http://www.backtheban.com/
League Against Cruel Sports: http://www.league.org.uk/

"andy" wrote in message
...
On 18 Mar, 00:43, Martin Jay wrote:
On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 00:07:32 +0000, Martin Jay

wrote:
snip
you are still persisiting with complaining that giffgaff has done
nothing to help, whioch is untrue as they have identified the service
and offered to help you claim your money back


The fact is giffgaff along with 3, Orange and O2 have done nothing
to prevent reverse charge scammers from attaching charges to
customers bills

Giffgaff like to act like they are some new fair deal network,
if they want to earn that reputation instead of just acting it
they have to at least copy T Mobile and Vodas opt out.

What would be revolutionary would be for them to go further
and offer opt in.

Steve Terry
--
Get a free Three 3pay Sim with £2 bonus after £10 top up
http://freeagent.three.co.uk/stand/view/id/5276

On Wed, 17 Mar 2010 18:24:55 -0700 (PDT), andy
wrote:

more bull****

you shortened the quote, and my very next post asked if you'd read the
middle sentence in it

then I quoted that quote, said there were three sentences, and which
was the middle of those three

Lots of quoting of quoting, which gets confusing. I simply asked for
clarification. That doesn't make me a liar. I'm still not sure
whether you meant the middle sentence of your original five or the
three I quoted. But you seem confused about it yourself now.

I really can't figure out why you find it such a thrill to spend hours
on this, abusing and rebutting every single offer of help, then
whining that there was nobody willing to help

Because, as I keep highlighting, the contract is between myself and
con-con giffgaff. The fact they've allowed a third party to put their
sticky paws into my account shouldn't be my problem.

Presumably you have little or no understanding of contract law?

it was suggested to you that contacting the number provider would help
glea info on the identity of the service subscribed to, but you
wouldn't have that either

I have no contract or relationship with them, whereas con-con giffgaff
presumably does because they handed over some of my account balance to
them.

I have, since, contacted them and should receive a response within the
next 24 hours. Hopefully a cheque for GBP5.10 will be in the post and
on its way to me by then.

you are still persisiting with complaining that giffgaff has done
nothing to help, whioch is untrue as they have identified the service
and offered to help you claim your money back

Yes, con-con giffgaff have lied to me, said it's not their fault and
suggested I go begging for a refund to a third party. Obviously
customer service isn't a high priority for them, which is presumably
why they rely on people in their caring, sharing, online community to
show the world their ignorance of customer service and everything
else.

even then, you were still ranting on very recently about having to
wait for 3 months to hear from Phonepayplus, when you're evidently too
arrogant or too lazy to simply phone up PlanetCalling and ask them for
a refund

Done that... waiting for reply and cheque to arrive in post.

and through all of this, let's not forget that there is a reasonable
chance you actually received a message, and then there's just a chance
that it would have thanked you for subscribing, and named itself

if so, all your demands that giffgaff sort this out would be somewhat
perverse if you sat back and let them make the effort to discover
something you may well have known all along

Of course. It's all my fault. After all, I'm only the customer who's
been conned out of GBP5.10.

And you're as wrong about me receiving a text message from
PlanetCalling thanking me for subscribing to their service as you are
about virtually everything else you've written.
--
Martin Jay
Back the Ban: http://www.backtheban.com/
League Against Cruel Sports: http://www.league.org.uk/